Does the American flag belong in church?
This is one I wish I'd written:
If they think about it at all, most believers probably see the flag and Pledge as tokens of affection for their country. In reality, both symbolize an infatuation with government. Churches hope to change circumstances through political force when Jesus called us to change hearts and minds with his message. We cheat ourselves, trusting the state's inferior and transitory power instead of the Almighty.
We also enhance rather than counter the state's supremacy. Our "patriotism" is really nationalism: unquestioning and enthusiastic support of political power. Christians eager to render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's have the rest of the week to do so. But the things rendered should not include our allegiance. That belongs to God. Why taint our worship by pledging it to the state's flag instead?
On trial for his life, Jesus Christ asserted his divinity while denying that his kingdom was of this world. It's ironic that Americans who accept the first truth devoutly reject the latter.
Well said. Sadly, there is no separation of church and state in the Empire because people think the government is divine.
On the brighter side, it looks like folks are beginning to notice their golden idols are tarnishing. With approval ratings for Congress and the president hitting the basement, maybe they'll soon notice the feet of clay on these false gods.
posted by Michael Tuggle @ Monday, July 28, 2008
14 Comments
14 Comments:
Mike
AN EMPHATIC NO is the answer to your question.
What is so awful in my own church is that it is standing in a place of sovreigntry( on the left) behind our pulpit whereas the Christian flag is on the right. I have asked our elders as well as the minister to remove it. If they will not remove it, at least put it on the right of the pulpit. NOPE
I go to church there because it is across the street from my home and my family was instrumental in the founding of this church some 100 yrs. ago ( It was once Methodist Episcopal South . Now United Methodist)
At a recent July 4th timeframe service. the pledge of allegiance was part of the ceremony. I stood and did not recite as I often do. The pledge to the Christian flag was said and I recited it. Lastly one of the hymns was.. you guessed it..The batttle hymn of the republic. I merely left my seat and left the sanctuary to return when the hymn was over.
Was I criticised? You bet and especially by the few remaining WWII vets in the congregation. I merely explained it is my freedom to do so while we still have it. They have heard the explanation from me many times on why the flag should NOT be in a church period It's becuse we worship the Lord and NOT this empire we have now.
This is very interesting food for thought. I have been so indoctrinated in my Southern Baptist roots to SEE an American flag in church but neither the Baptist church I attended growing up nor the Church of Christ I most recently attended said the pledge. The Church of Christ did not even have the flag in an obvious spot but in some corner.
I can understand adoring the flag and what it used to stand for. But as far as worshipping it, we are to hold no idols before our God and He is a jealous God.
pawmetto,
Good job! It's actions like yours that will eventually get people to thinking about what they're doing.
saddlegait,
Yes, and that's the problem -- the flag has become the primary object of veneration in too many churches. People are so used to it, they think it's only natural. Try to point out to them what they're doing, and they'll think you're crazy.
And then, late at night, they'll start to realize you know what you're talking about.
I have to ask (and this is the most appropriate place i could find to do it), do y'all consider yourselves patriots?
Some people wouldn't call me patriotic, but I love this country and its people and its way of life, but I hold the government in contempt. Do people not realise there is a difference [between the gov't and its people]?
Also, is it right for me to recite the Pledge at school? I know it's a Pledge to the "Republic". But that Republic doesn't really exist anymore..
(Sorry if this seems irrelevant.)
At the Catholic parish of which I have been a member for seven years or so that flag is not located in the sanctuary but in some corner that is not visible to most of those in the pews. Further no songs that celebrated the US were sung during the Mass on the Sunday nearest July 4th. Even though about eighty percent of parishonrs are Yankee.
fire and fire,
I don't believe the Pledge of Submission is appropriate anytime, anyplace. It's the most anti-American practise the socialists have foisted on us.
It nullifies the whole point of the Declaration, and makes citizens subservient to the government. Would the Founders have made such a pledge? No way.
For those who believe that the uS flag is a symbol of patriotism, may need to be enlightened. This so-called "American" flag, referred to by the Uniform Code of Military Justice(UCMJ). Is to be posted at military courts in areas occupied by US forces. Don't be fooled by the pretty gold fringe that surrounds this oppresive symbol. This flag was carried by the Army of the Potomac during its war against Southern people. Today that flag stands in every American courtroom as a public proclamation of the military occupation and government of the former States. Since this flag is the symbol of our oppressers'. I say let the federals' post their flags on there conquered lands to remind us of their harsh shade when entering thier buildings. To personally fly that flag is to proclaim defeat and submission.
I give respect to the U.S. flag where respect is due, but the place in my heart for a respectable flag has been taken by the Gadsden flag.
The "Stars and Stripes" doesn't mean anything but empirical oppression. It hasn't always, but that's what it stands for now.
I wouldn't soil a place of worship with ANY flag.
I have stopped even standing for the Pledge of Allegiance (and have upset many people by remaining seated).
As others have said, it pledges allegiance to a "Republic" that no longer exists; and under no circumstances will I declare that said Republic is indivisible (I'm surprised you Confederates haven't picked up on that!) To state that the Republic is indivisible is an affirmation of Lincoln and a rejection of the Constitution. My loyalty is to the Constitution.
And my heart with the Burgee, though after independence I would favor removing the stars.
marksc,
"Submission" is exactly what a private person is proclaiming when he flies the DC flag. And I really don't see how any honest person can argue otherwise.
son3,
I'll go along with that. A place of worship should transcend both politics and ideology.
harold thomas,
That's what it comes down to -- do we support the Constitution, or do we submit to the doctrine that might makes right?
No! It does not belong in church.
I have no use for the flag of "those people." Yeah, that one, the one with subjugated stars and the bloody stripes of a tyrant's whip.
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